One nation, divisible: The United States has become two separate nations. “The US is populated by groups of people who may as well be living in different countries. They have separate histories, cultures and visions for the future. They are two distinct nationalities, divided by mutual distrust and joined by mammoth public debt.” And as President Lincoln (the real one) said, “A house divided against itself cannot stand.”

{ 41 comments… read them below or add one }

Ruben November 7, 2012 at 6:55 am

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Two separate nations? Fine… Let’s have it out.

GhostntheMachine November 7, 2012 at 7:30 am
PsychoDad November 7, 2012 at 7:03 am

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Looking at the map last night really drove that home– solid blue northeast and west coast, a couple blue pockets inside. everything else solid red. mmrrrffkkr, I can’t believe new hampshire went harder for socky than even mass. did.

Well Texas? Gonna lead the secession?

GhostntheMachine November 7, 2012 at 7:34 am

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I know you check this now and then and that it’s anecdotal and not a true measure, but it’s still big enough to be ‘trending’. Big enough to put me off lunch too.

sa_rose November 7, 2012 at 11:51 pm

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We can secede legally. The rest of you would be illegal, civil disobedience. So one of you needs to lead that offensive.

Not so silent November 8, 2012 at 12:14 pm

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Notice that solid red portion down the middle of the country? We all leave at once, we have coal, oil, gas, manufacturing, banking. farm land and food. We set up a simple tax code, take care of our selves and let the other two dipshit halves of America deal with the problems they caused on their own. Border crossing stations where we charge a tax to blue staters, a constitution that lets us live in freedom, does not restrict rights of legal gun owners, does not waste money on failed green projects, and think of the chunk of taxes we could take. If everyone stands up at once what is Obama gonna do? A major portion of their tax revenue goes away, they will have food and other shortages…..hmmmmm Hell of an Idea, maybe revolutionary if I dare say so. Yes I know there are a billion items to work out, but I have faith in red staters and absolutely no faith in blue staters. All we have to do to be a sucess is NOT do whatever Washing and California do. To Quote Sean Connery in the Hunt for Red October, “A little revolution now and again is a good thing”.

sa_rose November 10, 2012 at 12:47 am

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and the seccessionists are now claiming they have had a 9000% increase since Tuesday!

deepthinker November 7, 2012 at 7:09 am

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Ruben and PhyscoDad

I’ve said before here and other places that this nation is headed toward another civil war. This one will be fought over taking from those who work and giving to those that don’t. When everything from obamacare starts taking affect in little more than 6 weeks and people realize the impact it will have, who are they going to blame. Sure as hell can’t blame Bush. It’s all barry’s and he’s going to be coming after many if his own. You know the 1%. Just remember the saying “I protested not when they came for the Jews, the gipsies, the mentally ill, the gays and now no one is left to protest for me”.

That Guy November 7, 2012 at 7:37 am

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Though Lincoln did disprove his own statement. Turns out that a house divided can stand… but only through force of arms.

ThatGuy November 7, 2012 at 7:50 am

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No civil war, that’s silly. A general decline in safety, maybe. Open warfare no.

This country is on an arc downward that will make the 1970s look like a disco fantasy. When it hits bottom and bounces a few times, then we’ll get back to what makes America great. In the mean time, don’t invest in long-term stuff, cash flow is king. Keep your money local so you can keep an eye on it. We are getting to s zero-sum economy. Take what you can from the stupid so they can take it back in taxes.

Alien November 7, 2012 at 9:37 am

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agreed.. Republic still stands 2016, 2020 and on.. This is no time for despair

GOP has strong House for many years now.. GOP gained Gubernatorial edge.. just revise the rhetoric around hispanics and all is in play again.. let the marijuana stuff pass and that’ll wipe out potential for lots of minority arrests, and more of them will be able to get jobs.. Strike at another grand bargain to slowly reduce the Debt.. Boehner and Obama were pretty damn close

Joe November 7, 2012 at 10:46 am

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I disagree. Obamacare is going to go into full affect, the new norm for unemployment is 8-10% with numbers that were fudged, the debt will be well over 20 trillion four years from now, millions more will be on welfare, the Second Amendment will be erased (along with a few others)… I could go on but you and I have four years to see what’s ahead. Patriotic, freedom loving Americans are now the minority in this country. You and I are the minority.

Alien November 7, 2012 at 10:56 am

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progressives were–and still are–scared shitless of prospect for grand bargain which make big cuts in entitlement programs as part of long-term debt reduction.. this alone should make us give the thought a 2nd look. Obama and Boehner need to be golfing together and work it out

say a long term restructuring of multiple budget items gets us down to $5T in 30 years..? Markets would love such a steady plan.. (obviously details matter)

Joe November 7, 2012 at 11:22 am

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Dude, get it out of your head that Obama cares about working with anyone. He doesn’t. He and all the Marxist around him have an agenda to destroy this country and the American people gave him four more years to do it.

Also, every time there is a ‘grand bargain’ all that happens is taxes get increased and nothing gets cut.

GhostntheMachine November 7, 2012 at 11:38 am

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Uh oh, this could be fun. I actually see, and agree with, both sides per se, the fight always revolves around solutions.

Alien November 7, 2012 at 12:26 pm

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Perhaps you can enumerate over All-Tax, No-Cut Grand Bargains for examination?

TBH I hadn’t even heard the phrase till after summer 2011, when Boehner made repeated stealth visits to POTUS to hash out a multi-trillion deal.. Those two men really took a stab at it–they quite literally golfed over it–but their respective party politics soured it all

So i’m not sure what the list of ‘grand bargains’ is to which you refer.. But i can imagine back to Reagan & Tip O’Neill dealing over Social Security and extending its lifetime, and it definitely involved cuts. Or maybe Clinton-Gingrich over welfare reform

Are Bill and Tip also marxists bent on destroying this country.. or is Obama just better at it? Maybe if the GOP can get that stuff out of their heads, they can win the next big one. Its time for Reaganesque Big Tent GOP again, or GOP loses 2016 & 2020 and on and on (and yeah, that goes on long enough and its baaad)

Go listen to some progressives completely losing their shit over the prospect of a grand bargain which cuts SS, medicare and medicaid in exchange for GOP concessions.. Try Sam Seder or Cenk Ugyar.. it’ll hurt, but you’ll see where i’m coming from.

A deal that has both sides screaming may just be about what we need… compromise

Joe November 7, 2012 at 5:46 pm

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Yes, there have been plenty of compromises over the years. Most involved immediate tax hikes and cuts to government promised in the future. The problem is those cuts never happen and all we get are new taxes. If some how Boner could get Obama to agree to substantial and immediate cuts, great. It’s not going to happen though. Republicans always get screwed in these deals, always. It’s exactly what happened to the ‘grand bargain’ between Tip and Reagan. We can’t compromise like that again.

As far as the welfare reform between Clinton and Newt, can’t save I’ve studied it enough to comment. Seems like good policy on the surface, but that’s no longer in existence because of Obama anyway. Plus Clinton actually moved to the center to get reelected, Obama has doubled down.

6 November 2012 November 8, 2012 at 6:21 pm

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No, INDUSTRIAL-SCALE ELECTORAL FRAUD won these elections for Obama, not the people!

There is the people of the United States on one side and there is a third-world gutter on the other, miserable majority of self-declared victims ruled by a few “citizens of the world” only loyal to their selfish desires.

DefHarryMelon November 7, 2012 at 11:07 am

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I think he’ll top 10 trillion new debt this term, or the first four years of it, anyway. I think this is easily the minimum he will steal from the future. It could be much higher. Unemployment will be around double what it is now, and that’s just the reported number, not the real number. People are gonna start croaking because the bureau will not be able to handle the task. Thin the herd. The Malthusian Diet Plan that the wookie has been the face of ( :0 ) since the lunch control of school kids became her job, is just the beginning. Anyone here recall reading the proclamation stalin made about not eating one’s own children neither trading your children for your neighbors children for the purpose of meat supply? To keep it out of the family, cuz that is so much worse, or something.

PsychoDad November 7, 2012 at 11:08 am

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Waiting for the bus this morning there were a couple of the regulars, professionals who commute into Boston, black. Heard the one of them laughing and saying, “His plans sure didn’t include us!”

Just wanted to go back home and crawl under the bed.

Sidekick November 7, 2012 at 12:12 pm

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Just enough people chose free shit over freedom. Alien, I appreciate your optimism but no-one is going to solve the debt issue with Obamacare just getting started. Romney and Ryan would have tried. Obama won’t even bother. He doesn’t care. If he did, we would have a budget passed each year. Now that he never has to run again, it is game on for a full assault on of what is left of the free market and limited government. Watch for a realigned SCOTUS erode further property rights. It ALL belongs to the government with this crowd. I’m sure you are aware of the etymology of the term “real estate”. The grand experiment ended last night over a free phone and an easy path to a disability claim. Sickening and unbelievable.

Alien November 7, 2012 at 1:14 pm

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Be assured, i will continue to return here for grounding.. my main thinking now involves concern over GOP broadening its demographic base.. It HAS to or its toast. And Dems need to seriously address the freeloader issue.. Its not 47%, but IT IS there, and they ignore it at all OUR peril

gotta step off for a bit.. behind a bit at work now this week

perlcat November 7, 2012 at 2:53 pm

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I actually think that long term, this is better for the nation. If Romney would have won, people would have gone to sleep, the lamestream press would have rebounded (money to be made in being the loyal opposition, none in spineless toadyism — you can buy Time for a dollar, and pretty soon Newsweek and a lot of others will go on the block, too), and people would not have looked for the correct solution to these issues.

The correct solution is for the states to claw back the power they ceded to the fed over the past 200-odd years under the foolish assumption that an all-powerful fed would take care of them, much like it does the indians, welfare moms, and other assorted dependents. Much like the rest of the nations that are dependent upon our largesse, the dependent class needs to be weaned off the tit. I guess an empty checkbook will do that as well as having the fortitude to do so — but face it, DC will NEVER have the guts to do what’s right.

If Mitt would have won, the best we could have hoped for was for something to happen and for Ryan to take over. Even so, both are technically “part of the problem” in the “how do you want to slouch into hell: 5 mph, or 90mph?” sense. I prefer not to slouch towards, but instead, bravely, boldly run away from the economic hell that our overlarge fed is pushing us into.

However, it still sucks that Barry won. Tells me we have a lot to do to fix this nation.

Sidekick November 7, 2012 at 3:17 pm

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I agree with you regarding broadening the demographic appeal of the Party. So much of it is messaging, though. It should be of universal appeal the ideas of limited government, free market principles, all boats rise with the tide but apparently it is not appealing to a vast segment of the population. I blame that on inarticulate establishment Repubs and their inability to seize the narrative.
Pericat makes a good point. Perhaps Romney would have only managed the crash. Obama and his policies will further damage the fiscal well-being of the country, diminish the military, and erode personal freedoms. Maybe only when we see the damage after two full terms will we decide to reassert our state sovereignty. I am skeptical. I do not think any of this can be reversed in 2016 and beyond. I believe too much entrenchment will have taken place. The new Americans like big government. We are now a full blown social democracy. That was decided last night.

KimmyQueen November 9, 2012 at 10:26 am

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Hispanics actually have a very conservative way of life, it is a matter of speaking to that WHILE acknowledging the illegal immigration situation. Although i dont approve of providing benefits to those that skip the fence first or instead to those that did it legally, I would say truly get control of the border and truly make it difficult to immigrate illegaly while get rid of the criminal elements that are here illegally (do not keep them here hogging space in prisons) and then don’t make it EASY but make it possible for those that jumped the fence to get into a path of citizenship but one that last a decade not a year. Appeal to teh conservative and the entrepreneurial nature of hispanics. That is the way to go.

deepthinker November 7, 2012 at 5:22 pm

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No what needs to happen is the GOP or Conservatives have to put forth a candidate that can and will articulate our views. This candidate has to be willing to step into the shit, get down and dirty, expose the mistruths and lies from the dim wits and their kind. If the GOP establishment continues to shove a person that they want to the front of the line, then it is done for and conservatives and tea party members will form another party.

perlcat November 7, 2012 at 6:16 pm

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Exactly. Too many BS accusations went unanswered by these guys — I mean, if *they* can’t tell if they’re a homicidal woman-hater in order to take issue with the accusation, who can?

Like Lincoln said, I want a general who can fight.

KimmyQueen November 9, 2012 at 10:28 am

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Romney was TOO above the sh*t. I can understand that being a man of class and distinction and money and of older distinction he really wanted to be above the sh*t, however, liberals and progressives live in sh*t, I am not saying that ANYONE conservative regardless of where they came from or where they are in life should live in sh*t but there has to be a way to not be in it but not necessarily be above it either to the point that you are not willing to fight for what you know is right.

Alien November 8, 2012 at 5:45 am

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I always thought Rubio talked pretty well about self reliance and limited government.. He may strike the right notes to slice of enough Hispanics to offset shrinking pool of whites. I don’t know, who else are you thinking of?

Sidekick November 8, 2012 at 6:12 am

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As of this moment, I do not see any GOP figure breaking out. Does not mean one won’t. Just came across a stat that 49.1% of households receive some sort of government support. I do not see how any traditional small government politician can succeed at the national level. The message is lost after the relentless effort by progressives to make government mom and dad. They are winning. How could they lose? They get the kids at age four or five and work on them for the rest of their lives. I am disgusted. Not angry but disgusted.

Alexander Tyler said it best 125 years ago. We all know the quote.

MDLION November 7, 2012 at 4:37 pm

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Blacks voted for Obama 93-6. I don’t think there’s much hope for the Republicans there. Single women want free birth control and legal abortion. I don’t think there’s much hope for the Republicans there. But while the Republicans lost single women by 30 points, they won married women by 20 points. Should the Republicans pander by spoiled brat young women? I don’t think so. I think the Republicans should try harder with Hispanics where there is hope. Bush got 44% of them in 2004, McCain 33 % in 2008, Romney 29% in 2012. This may be unpopular with some here, but I think the Republicans need to get the immigration issue behind them. Rubio might be a strong candidate in 2016, if something bad doesn’t happen before then. Romney didn’t say much about the social issues, but many Hispanics are socially conservative. I thought Romney was going to get an astounding number of votes, but he appears to have received 2 million less than Kerry in 2004.

sa_rose November 8, 2012 at 12:01 am

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I am a single womna, I have never ad an abortion, nor have I ever received free birth control. They have painted ALL women with the same brush, but we don’t all support Obama or any of his policies, unless he made it a policy to hand over his office to someone with a clue. That is what Republicans need to remember. And they need to remember that a great deal of Obama’s appeal was his charisma. Find some up and coming GOP wanna bes and start grooming them for the next few elections. We really had little to offer these last 2 presidential elections.

Sidekick November 8, 2012 at 3:41 am

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I think we can make the claim that as GOP presidential candidates go, Reagan was an aberration. Other than him over the last forty years we got Ford, Bush I , Dole, Bush II, McCain, and Romney. Tell me, which in that bunch (elected or not) was really a conservative, believed in limited government, and individual freedom? I argue none of the above.

MDLION November 8, 2012 at 5:55 pm

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Rose, you’re one of the 31% of single women who saw through Obama. Unfortunately, 67% didn’t. Married women turned out to be closer than I thought with Romney only winning them 53-46.

KimmyQueen November 9, 2012 at 10:33 am

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Don’t discont Black people. Romney and the Republicand FAILED miserably to speak to the true Black Christian/Religious people out there. If you speak to a church going Black person and explain the merits of limited government and where Obama stands on a lot of moral issues, you actually get a positive response you may not be able to win them all because after all to some of them Obama blackness wiins it all but you actually will get really great results if you speak to the POINTS that concerns them as Christian and religious people where they stand and where the conservative movement stand, but Romney et al… FAILED to dos . That is the problem.

I am a single young woman I think that the Republicans failed to speak to how women like me benefit through conservatism. I KNOW this but not a lot of women who are young and single do. There has to be a way to speak to how conservatism aids single young women be independent in their personal and work lives and search for their happiness without government as a fake ass husband. Again it was a fail.

Conservatives and Lincoln/Reagan Republicans need to know how to speak to people where they stand. This is where Jesus Christ excelled so well in His life on Earth (and His disciples and apostles and prophets and so on). I don’t know who can teach them and who can come up and do it but it needs to happen soon.

davidintexas November 8, 2012 at 4:54 am

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The Constitution of the State of Texas (1876), says the following; “Texas is a free and independent State … All political power is inherent in the people … they have at all times the inalienable right to alter their government in such manner as they might think proper.”

It is time to leave a nation that re-elected a failed, arrogant bastard simply because he is black. I seriously give up on the United States.

Not so silent November 8, 2012 at 12:23 pm

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David there are a lot of us trapped in blue states that feel the same way you do…This country has turned against our founding principals in the name of free shit. People are dependent on the democraps to keep handing it out. To win all they did was to buy the election, giveaway enough free crap and get votes. Too many of these pecker head Obama supporters say Obama is great, he gave me da phone etc etc…So now among the probelms we need to overcome is to educate the stupid that walk among us. Democraps take away pride and replace it with a plasma tv and food stamps..and yet these same gimme free shit people bitch about how the rest of us are racists cause we don’t want to give them more free shit. I give all year long, but to those groups and indiviuals that REALLY need help, not some low life son of a bitch that refuses to get off their lard ass and do something with their life besides eat cheetos and play with their play station, and vote himself more free shit. Am I a one percenter? Hell no, but I am part of the middle class that is loosing ground to welfare mutts. Yea I am pissed, sorry about the rant, but I am sure Johnny basement will be along any moment and smear some more cheeto crap on the keyboard tell me how wrong I am. He is just one example of people that stop by this website and have not got a clue about anything that made this country great, he is what I mean by the stupid that walk among us. God Bless Texas my friend…

sa_rose November 10, 2012 at 12:53 am

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s much as Ihate to bring it up, look how many of our military volunteered to get the benefits (particularly money for college) then bitched when they had to go to war? I mean, no one WANTS to go to war unless they have a screw loose somewhere, but clearly these folks wanted the benefits, but never expected to have to pay the price. Its endemic in the society!

KimmyQueen November 9, 2012 at 10:34 am

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I agree it is time to close the borders and do something maybe get some trade agreements with like minded states we got sea and we got land so we good.

danybhoy November 9, 2012 at 12:53 pm

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I don’t know where he got it from, but El-Rushbo read something from someone who said the GOP should just stand back & let Obama & the Dems do whatever they want. Make it a 1 party state, so when America sh!ts the bed, there is absolutley no doubt as to who gets the blame. I actually think that is the way to go, since America is an addict, & until they hit bottom, nothing changes. Just allow the nation to bottom out, whatever the cost, & rebuild from that point.

KimmyQueen November 9, 2012 at 1:07 pm

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Hannity said that the moment everything goes to hell (my words) people will cry out for conservatism to come in and make everything right again (paraphrasing his point). I believe that he is right. My opinion of course is that people should cry out to G-d (Jesus) for help, I am sure that he would actually agree with that, but I think his point as he placed it is apt. Not saying that Jesus is a conservative or whatever, but He I am sure would approve of GOOD and SOUND government that improves the lives of everyone and allows people to be the best that they can be and apport to the nation so those who are truly in need can truly get true help.

Hannity also said that we deserve Obama. I disagree that I DO and that others do, but I know what he is saying and I think he meant it the way you meant it. It is not until people are on the true dirt that they will cry out for someone to come in and take care of the mess. Let’s just hope that the mess wont be so bad that a GOOD person would not even consider coming in and stepping up to the challenge.