Anti-God group erects competition for nativity scene in Florida Capitol

SolsticeNativity.jpg


Anti-God group erects competition for nativity scene in Florida Capitol. Nothing like turning Christmas into a never ending 60 Minutes Point/Counterpoint segment. Why can’t atheists go somewhere and dance naked around a big fire at midnight, instead of whining about Christmas all the time?

This post was last modified on November 10, 2021

J.P. Travis: Born and raised in Grand Rapids, Michigan, 1976 graduate of University of Michigan, father, grandfather, husband, founder and CEO of Travelyn Publishing (http://www.travelynpublishing.com/), and passionate anti-government believer in individual liberty.

View Comments (47)

  • It depicts Ben Franklin, the Statue of Liberty, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison and the Bill of Rights.

    What I find interesting is that this group uses Founders that believe in God and celebrated religious holidays. Seems to me that they are a bit confused.

    • They like to use Ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson because they were deist. Deists believe in the existence of God, on purely rational grounds, without any reliance on revealed religion or religious authority or holy text.
      It's laughable when they say things like our founding fathers were mostly deists because Ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson are the only two listed here unless you count Cornelius Harnett, a signer of the Articles of Confederation.

      http://www.adherents.com/gov/Founding_Fathers_Religion.html

      • Let me correct the record here. I recently read "The Jefferson Lies." The book is meticulously researched and documented, and the upshot is Jefferson was not a deist. He was adamantly Christian. What Jefferson was, and this cannot be disputed by anyone, was an intellectual polyglot and prolific writer of letters. He wrote something like nineteen or twenty thousand letters in his lifetime and these were LETTERS, not Tweets. Broad, long, extremely intellectual writings. Many of them were written to intellectual counterparts around the world and discussed questions he was pondering. Naturally, when you pick and choose which letter you quote and which period of his life, you can quote a sentence or two that makes him sound deist. He was not. Later in life he had a brief period when he was studying and absorbing the writings of Hume (a Scottish skeptic), but he later rejected Hume's philosophy. Naturally, people who want to paint Jefferson as a deist love to quote from the period when he was studying Hume.

        Another thing that affected Jefferson's writings is a wave that hit his local area around Charlottesville after the Great Awakening. Naturally, if you are a religious man and attend church regularly you can be affected by whatever your church is currently teaching. In Jefferson's case, his county was the epicenter for the young nation's brief flirtation with Christian Primitivism. This too affected some of his writings and is the primary reason you see him questioning the Trinity for a while - he was hearing that from the pulpit every Sunday!

        The final thing that affected his writings was the loss of his beloved wife and two or three of his children (I can't remember how many children he lost). He was disconsolate to the point where friends thought he was going to die. Bitter losses make any man question God, and whatever thoughts a man expresses in those dark moments should not be used to judge his whole life's viewpoint but that's what the atheists try to do with Jefferson.

        • I agree with everything you've written. I was giving the benefit of doubt to the few because of the overwhelming opposition to them all being religious. Ben Franklin is also misquoted by cherry picking many of his writings. After reading the following address by him to the Constitutional Convention I don't see how Ben Franklin could be called a deist either.

          Mr. President

          The small progress we have made after 4 or five weeks close attendance & continual reasonings with each other,”our different sentiments on almost every question, several of the last producing as many noes and ays, is methinks a melancholy proof of the imperfection of the Human Understanding. We indeed seem to feel our own want of political wisdom, some we have been running about in search of it. We have gone back to ancient history for models of Government, and examined the different forms of those Republics which having been formed with the seeds of their own dissolution now no longer exist. And we have viewed Modern States all round Europe, but find none of their Constitutions suitable to our circumstances.

          In this situation of this Assembly, groping as it were in the dark to find political truth, and scarce able to distinguish it when presented to us, how has it happened, Sir, that we have not hitherto once thought of humbly applying to the Father of lights to illuminate our understandings? In the beginning of the Contest with G. Britain, when we were sensible of danger we had daily prayer in this room for the divine protection. ”Our prayers, Sir, were heard, and they were graciously answered. All of us who were engaged in the struggle must have observed frequent instances of a Superintending providence in our favor. To that kind providence we owe this happy opportunity of consulting in peace on the means of establishing our future national felicity. And have we now forgotten that powerful friend? I have lived, Sir, a long time, and the longer I live, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth- that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid? We have been assured, Sir, in the sacred writings, that "except the Lord build the House they labour in vain that build it." I firmly believe this; and I also believe that without his concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better than the Builders of Babel: We shall be divided by our little partial local interests; our projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall become a reproach and bye word down to future ages. And what is worse, mankind may hereafter from this unfortunate instance, despair of establishing Governments be Human Wisdom and leave it to chance, war and conquest.

          I therefore beg leave to move, that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and its blessings on our deliberations, be held in this Assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the Clergy of the City be requested to officiate in that service.

          • It's funny you mention Ben Franklin. I bought "The Jefferson Lies" and "The Autobiography of Benjamin Franklin" at the same time, so someday quite soon I will be able to pontificate about him as well. Won't that be great?

          • This is one of the biggest reasons I love this site. I learn so much I never knew about by reading what you guys write. It's great that there are so many people well versed on so many different subjects, it's what makes you all such great people, and what drives you know who, crazy!

          • Thanks, but I tend toward the wit more than the information. I have always liked to make people laugh. I do like to make sure that people also know that I'm not just the jester, I have some learnin' in my background too. ;-)

        • Well, I can't say anything on the book you cite, but it's quite well known that Jefferson also published a heavily edited version of the New Testament, with all the "superstitious" material left out so that it was nothing more than a general moral guidebook: "... the most sublime and benevolent code of morals which has ever been offered to man. I have performed this operation for my own use, by cutting verse by verse out of the printed book, and arranging the matter which is evidently his, and which is as easily distinguishable as diamonds in a dunghill."

          And if I may quote wholesale from Wikipedia: "Also referring to the 1804 version, Jefferson wrote, "A more beautiful or precious morsel of ethics I have never seen; it is a document in proof that I am a real Christian, that is to say, a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus."

          Jefferson's claim to be a Christian was made in response to those who accused him of being otherwise, due to his unorthodox view of the Bible and conception of Christ. Recognizing his rather unique views, Jefferson stated in a letter (1819) to Ezra Stiles Ely, "You say you are a Calvinist. I am not. I am of a sect by myself, as far as I know."

          Well. Jefferson may have considered himself to be a Christian, in the rather narrow sense that he followed the morality to be found in the raw words of Jesus, but one could as easily say Gandhi was too. Unless there is substantial evidence to the contrary, I'm afraid that any claim, including his own, that he was a Christian reminds me of President Lincoln's riddle on how many legs a sheep has, if you call the tail a leg: call the tail what you like, it still only has four legs.

          • Jefferson created two different versions of the New Testament, not just one. Where you are going wrong is in accepting the liberal storyline that these versions were meant to replace the Bible. They were not. One was specifically intended for Native Americans and that's the one liberal atheists generally refer to when they talk about the "Jefferson Bible." It might interest you to know that Jefferson was a lifelong member of the Virginia Bible Society, an organization which distributed Bibles throughout the new world, which would indeed be an odd hobby for a person who considered the book to be full of superstition. "In fact, during a period of personal economic crisis... he arranged a personal loan and even offered to sell his own cherished private library to Congress to raise additional funds..." for the Virginia Bible Society.

            In "The Jefferson Lies" there is a whole chapter devoted to the notion that Jefferson wrote his own Bible. In 1798 Jefferson personally helped finance the printing of America's first hot-press Bible, did you know that?

            Neither of the two abridgements that Jefferson created from the New Testament did he title with the word "Bible" so clearly he did not intend them to be considered Bibles. The one to which you refer very specifically states in the title that it is an "Abridgement" of "The Philosophy of Jesus" intended for "the Use of Indians, Unembarrassed with Matters of Fact or Faith beyond the level of their Comprehension." (Apparently they liked very long titles back then. I haven't even given you half of it.)

          • He completely demolishes the notion that Jefferson fathered any children by a slave. Turns out the timing was completely wrong for him being the father - but completely right for his widower brother who acted as Jefferson's manager for a while and, until he remarried, had a habit of hanging out and partying with the slaves.

            DNA tests have now disproved that Thomas Jefferson fathered any children by his slaves, but the idea that he did so refuses to die.

          • Fascinating. I greatly admire Jefferson although of course did not approve of the fact that he kept slaves and so on... however if one has to choose between being Jefferson's slave or the slave of a Democrat freak... well the choice is obvious.

          • Fascinating because one of my least favorite historians and fellow college alumni has been trading on this lie for years. He recently wrote a book about Jefferson that now appears to be largely bs. I need to read more on this topic. Just made my day because I always felt the siring of children with slaves did not fit with the rest of his life.

          • There are some that have made it their life goal to destroy our Christian heritage which, I know, made this country great and can do it again. Perhaps that's what they're afraid of.

    • Many of the founding fathers were Freemasons. One ofthe requirements is to believe in some higher power. Your choice of who or whAt.

  • Idiots.

    The reason for Christmas is that it is a MASS in honor of CHRIST. (Isn't the English language an interesting thing? Some stuff just sort of hides there in plain sight.)

    The fact that it's at the time of the stupid celebration for "the unconquered sun" is not because the church "stole" the pagan holiday, but because the pagans THEMSELVES couldn't quite give up their old holidays and customs as they were a traditional part of village life. So the church didn't punish them for it, because the church was FORGIVING AND INCLUSIVE!

    I had a guy at work telling me that he's going to celebrate Saturnalia because "that's what Christmas actually is, but the Catholics stole it." I told him that Saturn was actually Chronos and the Romans had "stolen" that from the Greeks.

    Nothing is "stolen." It's people moving from place to place, and adopting new ideas. It's not insidious; it's simple cultural shift. Digging back to find the origins of things and going "Ah-hah! This was stolen!" is something a twelve-year-old might do, but adults?

    • I have ZERO problem with Christmas. I greatly enjoy the time of fellowship and celebration with my loved ones.

  • How you chose to believe or not believe is none of my business. However, this nation was founded on Judea/Christian principle and as such Christmas should be celebrated in the public square.

    My question to all of the atheists is this. If you do not believe in God or Jesus, why are you celebrating Christmas at all? Why do you not just go on into work and work the day just like any other day?

    I worked with someone who is Buddhist and one who is Jehovah Witness. The Buddhist refused to work Christmas because it was a recognized holiday and he was going to take it even though his subordinate staff had to work. The Jehovah Witness works every Christmas and Christmas Eve even when it is their scheduled RDOs.

    Guess who has the most respect even though they have less rank?

    • I don't celebrate Christmas at all. To do so would be very hypocritical of me. I pay as little attention as possible. If I were offered the chance to work on ANY holiday, I would jump at it. Not only to make extra money, but to let someone else go home and enjoy the holiday, since it means something to them.

      To me, the calendar is just a way of keeping track of what other people have planned. No particular day is any different from any other day.

  • "Why can’t atheists go somewhere and dance naked around a big fire at midnight, instead of whining about Christmas all the time?"

    Because their lives are empty, sad and miserable. My experience with miserable people is that they want to share that misery. Not that they do this on purpose, it's just human nature. Hence the old adage; "Misery loves company."

    • My life isn't the slightest bit empty, sad, or miserable. I'm having a great time. But if I start dancing naked, that place is gonna clear out. So I just watch.

  • Last night the first fair minded atheist I've seen on TV in like forever came to the O'Reilly Factor. Although he didn't go all the way to condemn the action of atheists that do sh*t like this, he did say that these actions are counterproductive to the atheist cause. That is to say that instead of antagonizing and mocking people for their beliefs, atheists should concentrate on promoting their point of views on religion and ethics without provoking people into anger. He mentioned that atheists tend to be seen in a negative light and to be one of the most mistrusted people in the USA, if true, then they are not going about it the right way by continuing to do thing stuff like this. He made the case that they should promote unity among themselves and welcome people who for whatever reason feel alone or out of place during this holiday. He made a good point that signs such as these shouldn't exist and sicne atheists have the same rights of freedom of expression as others, they can still do signs, but instead they should state something around the lines of atheists not needing to feel alone nor out of place during the holidays and to contact this person or organization to learn more. Promote even a way to live in togetherness with those that do celebrate Christmas in a religious way while promoting the celebration of Christmas in its secular format (which does exist). Christmas is a very unique holiday where it has a religious format and an acceptable secular format. Atheists should feel welcome to celebrate Christmas secular format or not while leaving the religious format alone and without mocking and derision. If what the man said was true that atheists are among the most distrusted people in the USA, they have earned it and they should indeed change tactics. Derision and mocking earns more disrespect and mistrust from people even people that are not religious, because no one likes to be mocked and derided for strong benign belief systems. Atheists are killed/murdered in many parts of the world for not believing in allah. They should remember that and fight against that and leave those that are happy to live in peace with them alone.

  • The godless horde is on the rampage like the gay horde, and the immigrant horde, and the rest of the hordes...they feel that Obama may collapse into a shit heap so it is now or never to push their agenda.....The non-believers here in Sacramento spend a shitload of money on a bunch of billboards...If they don't like Christmas, I would suggest they take their show on the road to North Korea..No problem there, they will be talked to by the fat little pumpkin fart who "thinks" he is god and was farted out of the side of a mountain, or so the story goes...

  • Satan's plan from the start is to draw us from God. Our first Biblical parents gave in to the lies.

    The serpent said to the woman, "You surely will not die! "For God knows that in the day you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil. Genesis 3:4-5

    Once separated from God Satan gains control. The more control gained the more you will be like the father of lies.

    Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
    Who substitute darkness for light and light for darkness; Who substitute bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter! 21Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes And clever in their own sight! Isaiah 5:20-21

  • On the upside maybe the children can now learn what Winter Solstice is. Yeah, that's the ticket. It's for the children.

    • You know what? People want to celebrate it, I got no problem it is all good. However I shouldn't have to be made to feel bad for celebrating what I want to celebrate. I think that there is a misunderstanding here about persecution. Atheists are not persecuted in this country. They imagine persecution because people celebrate something they don't and because they don't seem themselves represented during the season. Why not create their own holiday and celebrate it in peace...?

      • Kimmy, I see the racist liberals that visit here are ganging up on the only black person on the site.
        Proof of the left’s war on women and minorities.
        At least we love you.

      • Yet again the Carter legacy comes alive. Quagmire & Heniz-Kerry were played as fools and idiots. The Israelis and the Saduais are working together in order to launch a joint strike. That should wake the quagmire and lurch out of their drunken haze.

        • *shrugs* The freaks come out at night. Probably the racist trolls I butt hurt or one or two that are creating several accounts. There was a pathetic attempt at creating some controversy with a fake account at a bogus website that went nowhere. Eh whatever... I feel special today. ;-)

        • Kimmy, you are defending the atheists' right to celebrate the season any way they see fit, so it must be the Troll Parade out in full force.

          And by the way, have a VERY MERRY CHRISTMAS!!

          • True. I don't want atheists to feel bad about this season and they are welcomed to participate or not. I have always said that there are real atheists and they are fake ones... just like they are real practicing Christians and nominal Christians (CINO's). However be it atheists or not they are definitely trolls and it is confirmed by you getting a lot of them as well.

            Merry Christmas!

        • I'm an atheist myself, but I DESPISE atheist trolls like these shitbirds. It's the stupid assholes like this that are the reason that nobody takes them seriously. Outside of their little troll pit (Reddit), nobody likes them, and they have no real life friends

          • Yeah even on posts where there is really no reason to TD or even TU for that matter... Waste of timers...

  • These folks seem to have confused "freedom of speech" with "freedom from being offended by freedom of speech".

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