Do not stand between Michelle Obama and the fat cakes

by editor on June 28, 2011

We were confused when we saw the words “Michelle Obama” and “Fat Cakes” in the same headline. We thought the latter was a nickname for the former, but we were wrong.

First Lady Michelle Obama visited a restaurant in Botswana village and began chowing down on French fries and a local delicacy called fat cakes like that night’s dinner was an unachievable dream.

Of course, this was a direct violation of the nanny state food rules she laid out for the rest of us, but that matters now because she is, after all, Michelle Antoinette and we are the little people.

“Let them eat fat cakes.”

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brm
Member
brm

I don’t have time to look for the troll’s split threads, so I’m starting a new one.

Oblovia wrote: Translation: “Well, shoot—-didja have to notice that none of my examples pertained to U.S. public schools?”

The troll has her uses after all. She just made me think of the following new ad campaign for the great state of Michigan:

“Dearborn, Michigan. It only FEELS like a different country!”

What part of DEARBORN, MICHIGAN does our troll think is located in another country?

Olivia
Member
Olivia

The troll has her uses after all. She just made me think of the following new ad campaign for the great state of Michigan:

“Dearborn, Michigan. It only FEELS like a different country!”

What part of DEARBORN, MICHIGAN does our troll think is located in another country?
***************************
I don’t understand, Barb. Were you going to produce some evidence that Dearborn, Michigan public schools are allowing Muslims to hold prayer services that ban non-Muslims and menstruating women from the premises?

If not, then why are you even bringing it up in response to my question?

RockingHorseGuy
Member

Thirds!

Ha! Back in the game!

drb
Member
drb

Good for you RHG

KimmyQueen
Member

It is like riding a bike, it all comes back once you get in the groove.

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Author: Barb R
Comment:
Did it just say that Christmas concerts are not allowed on the taxpayers’ dime or on property paid by the taxpayers, but that it is acceptable for Muslims to hold prayer services in a public school cafeteria during school hours while barring all non-Muslims and menstruating females.

Really. Really?
*************************************
Evidence, please?

brm
Member
brm

Evidence? Is the troll truly that incompetent? I’m sure someone with all those post secondary school degrees is capable of using Google, oui?

Try Googling this: Toronto public school muslim prayers

KimmyQueen
Member

Okay let’s fast forward… since we are doing the Troll’s job, let’s just go to what the troll will say… The troll will come back with a translation about how right wingers can’t understand the complexities of a religion or else that right wingers are racists for not allowing muslims to freely exercise their religion… a wise person will remind her that there is a liberal mantra of separation of church and state, the troll will say that muslims do not go to church they go to mosques… then everyone else will laugh at the troll for being so stupid and hilarious.

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

Kimmy, are you psychic? 🙂

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Kimmy, are you psychic?
****************************
Hardly, since she’s merely parroting popular right wing wishful thinking.

There is a difference between giving public school students the opportunity to live up to their religious beliefs while attending school, and promoting those beliefs. Sometimes there’s a fine line between the two practices, and it’s up to the courts to decide exactly where that line lies.

Most of the arguments I see here are not about where that line is or should be. Essentially, they all seem to be about fear rather than problem solving. And, of course, bending over backwards to ridicule anyone who doesn’t conform to far right wing groupthink.

drb
Member
drb

whooohoo

KimmyQueen
Member

Wow… I better hone these skills, because I got to admit, it is kind of eerie to realize that I was right. She actually said that I was hardly a psychic yet went on to stipulate pretty much what I said that she would: we are dumb right wingers who cannot understand the complexities of a religion and we are racists because we are not letting them do whatever they want. Amazing. I think I got a second career here. I can write a book titled “Understanding Liberal Insanity: How to know what they will say to what you say”. I’ll make so much money Ann Coulter will be asking me for loans.

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Wow… I better hone these skills, because I got to admit, it is kind of eerie to realize that I was right. She actually said that I was hardly a psychic yet went on to stipulate pretty much what I said that she would: we are dumb right wingers who cannot understand the complexities of a religion and we are racists because we are not letting them do whatever they want.
****************************
Why, that’s amazing, Kimmy. All you did was make a grossly oversimplified observation, yet you were able to predict that I would tell you your observation was grossly oversimplified.

Is that what passes for brilliance these days among the far right?

KimmyQueen
Member

THIRD!!!!

I feel like I cheated here, but hey all is fair in the whack a troller game.

drb
Member
drb

You can’t cheat in “whack-a-troll” you either get the 3rd thumb or you don’t. And considering how long that one stayed open, I think some of our fellow whack-a-trollers were leaving that one for you since it was directed toward you in the first place.

KimmyQueen
Member

LOL overall it doesn’t take that much ESP to figure out what Olivia is going to come up with.

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

😀
😀
😀

RockingHorseGuy
Member

Nope, Olivia is fairly predictable.

RockingHorseGuy
Member

Kimmy isn’t psychic. I used to date a psychic, and she was never that accurate.

perlcat
Member

Yep, my psychic takes checks — obviously not a good psychic.

RockingHorseGuy
Member

I’m still trying to figure out how come my psychic girlfriend didn’t know I was going to dump her.

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Evidence? Is the troll truly that incompetent? I’m sure someone with all those post secondary school degrees is capable of using Google, oui?

Try Googling this: Toronto public school muslim prayers

*********************
Toronto isn’t part of the United States, Barb, and therefore none of us have anything to say about how they choose to do things there. Try again. 😉

brm
Member
brm

I never said it was in the United States. I’m sorry you just assumed it was.

Olivia
Member
Olivia

I never said it was in the United States. I’m sorry you just assumed it was.

************************
Barb, we’re discussing U.S. politics here, not Canadian politics. Obviously you knew that, because you tried arguing about this nation (allegedly) being founded on “Judeo Christian values.”

Did it not occur to you that that means you should produce examples WITHIN THE U.S. to back up your point, and not anecdotes about what Toronto is doing or not doing?

Or did you just hope I wouldn’t notice that you were using examples from the wrong country?

brm
Member
brm

“Barb, we’re discussing U.S. politics here, not Canadian politics.”

Uhmmm, no, we weren’t.

We were discussing your poem entitled “Thank a Liberal”. It did not specify that we were to only thank American liberals.

Olivia
Member
Olivia

“Barb, we’re discussing U.S. politics here, not Canadian politics.”

Uhmmm, no, we weren’t.

We were discussing your poem entitled “Thank a Liberal”. It did not specify that we were to only thank American liberals.

***************************
Translation: “Well, shoot—-didja have to notice that none of my examples pertained to U.S. public schools?”

Thank you for illustrating my point so well, Barb. Thank you, too, for providing another line to that anonymous essay (it’s neither mine nor a poem): “If you don’t know how to discuss an issue without oversimplifying, name calling, prevaricating, stacking the deck, jumping to conclusions or doing a bait-and-switch, thank a far right conservative.”

brm
Member
brm

I can’t believe I’m doing this. This is the last one, Oblivia. After this, do your own research.

Excerpt from an article in the “Education Reporter” February 2008:

Inside one Muslim prayer room

At Normandale Community College, a public institution in Bloomington, Minnesota, Star Tribune contributor Katherine Kersten reports that a meditation room on campus has become a Muslim-only prayer room with a number of features that make students of other faiths unwelcome. A sign posted at the entrance asks visitors to remove their shoes. Another sign lists the schedule for Islam’s five daily prayers, and an arrow inside the room points in the direction of Mecca. Most noticeably, a chest-high barrier partitions the room to separate men and women during prayer. The college building crew erected this barrier, and college officials placed the signs asking students to enter barefoot — “basically a courtesy to Muslim students,” says Dean of Student Affairs Ralph Anderson.

On the side of the barrier intended for women, there is a pile of shawls and head-coverings, or hijaab. A pamphlet entitled “Hijaab and Modesty” instructs women on proper attire and comportment according to Islam. Women should stay at home, according to the pamphlet, and their speech must not “be such that it is heard.” The same pamphlet speaks disparagingly of Christians and Jews, “the enemies of Allah’s religion. . . . Remember that you will never succeed while you follow these people.”

“For all practical purposes, this meditation room is essentially a Muslim prayer room,” Normandale history professor Chuck Chalberg told Kersten. “Something this unprecedented goes beyond religious toleration.” (Star Tribune, 12-18-07)

A similar situation occurred at George Mason University in Virginia. Some non-Muslim students protested the barrier dividing men and women and the requirement to enter barefoot they encountered at an on-campus meditation room. Complaints and an article in the school newspaper prompted school officials to request that Muslim students move barriers and prayer rugs aside when not in use.

The full article can be read here: http://www.eagleforum.org/educate/2008/feb08/muslim-students.html

Now go put your niqab on and hit the town, Obloviate.

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

Awww, Oblivious seems to have left the building!

drb
Member
drb

Temporary hiding

DefHarryMelon
Member
DefHarryMelon

Progressive liberalism, communism, extreme leftist socialism and all the other aberrational ideologies, like total psychoses, are not bound by geography. The real question might have something to do with how America, with such a successful capitalist driven republic, could be so blind as to let the disease of the greedy peckerwoods take us to the edge. This government has been a puppet show for over 20 years! Don’t get caught peeking behind the curtain.

KimmyQueen
Member

oh wow I got the third on that one.

drb
Member
drb

thrill of the hunt. ;D

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Author: Barb R
Comment:
Did it just say that Christmas concerts are not allowed on the taxpayers’ dime or on property paid by the taxpayers, but that it is acceptable for Muslims to hold prayer services in a public school cafeteria during school hours while barring all non-Muslims and menstruating females.

Really. Really?
*************************************
Evidence, please?
************************************
Poppajoe:
http://www.danielpipes.org/2236/spreading-islam-in-american-public-schools
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-07-25-muslim-special-treatment-from-schools_N.htm
http://www.suite101.com/content/muslim-prayer-in-public-schools-a26209
http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=12325
http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/0712/p01s03-ussc.html
http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/03/us_public_schools_teaching_chi_1.html
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5hZ1Teh3JilpIBlmHrV58PvRRU09Q
************************
Well, I went through these links—at least, the ones that made any pretense at being news stories rather than rabid opinion pieces—-and didn’t see any evidence of prayer services in public school cafeterias that barred all non-Muslims and menstruating women.

What I did see were complaints by Christians that Muslims shouldn’t be accommodated in ANY way, even though Christians themselves enjoy numerous accommodations in public schools (no Sunday classes and no school on Christmas or Easter, for example).

Mind you, I agree that schools shouldn’t set up prayer sessions—not for Muslims, not for Jews, not for pagans or Christians or Buddhists or any other religion. On the other hand, it isn’t the government’s job to stifle independent prayer that doesn’t distract others or force others to listen or participate. Is it reasonable to set aside a few minutes at regular intervals for students to use as they please, either for praying, bathroom breaks, visiting the library or chatting? Sounds okay to me, as long as faculty members don’t get involved in prayer sessions, or encourage students to attend prayer sessions.

It’s not easy to draw the line here. If you outlaw ALL opportunities (individual and otherwise) for religious expression in public schools, then you must do so across the board. To claim otherwise would be to support government sponsored religion.

A bit of investigation revealed that your World Nut Daily opinion piece (aided and abetted by “Assist Ministries”—which WND dishonestly described as a news source) distorted the truth rather badly. The California school district in question was teaching about various world religions and culture, not indoctrinating students to be Muslims.

The rabid opinion piece from the American Thinker website (a misnomer if there ever was one!) was merely a diatribe by someone who thinks that everyone should be indoctrinated to fear and hate Muslims. It has no place in any discussion about fair treatment of religions or those who practice them.

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

Some say schools giving Muslims special treatment
Updated 7/26/2007 11:04 AM

By Oren Dorell, USA TODAY

Some public schools and universities are granting Muslim requests for prayer times, prayer rooms and ritual foot baths, prompting a debate on whether Islam is being given preferential treatment over other religions.
The University of Michigan at Dearborn is planning to build foot baths for Muslim students who wash their feet before prayer. An elementary school in San Diego created an extra recess period for Muslim pupils to pray.

At George Mason University in Fairfax, Va., Muslim students using a “meditation space” laid out Muslim prayer rugs and separated men and women in accordance with their Islamic beliefs.

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

Blolivia’s Photo
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brm
Member
brm

LOL! Well done, poppa!

KimmyQueen
Member

LOL okay wow that was funny.

drb
Member
drb

Oh Poppa, you flatter her.

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Right Barb! They won’t let you have a Christmas concert in the school because it will be at the taxpayers expense. That is a privilege afforded only to Muslims!
********************
Poppajoe, can you list five school districts anywhere in the U.S. that regularly host concerts dedicated to Muslim religious holidays at taxpayer expense? How about three? One?

Didn’t think so.

Can anyone help him out here?

poppajoe49
Guest
brm
Member
brm

Poppajoe beat me. I don’t know why we do all the hard work for the troll’s benefit though.

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

Because she can’t find it herself. The search engine at Media Matters blocks any result that won’t support their agenda.
In the meantime, I’mstill waiting for a reply to the post where I proved she was a bigot!
https://www.ihatethemedia.com/do-not-stand-between-michelle-obama-and-the-fat-cakes/comment-page-1?replytocom=97535#respond

perlcat
Member

“The search engine at Media Matters blocks any result that won’t support their agenda.”

Hmph. Chinese google isn’t all that it’s cracked up to be, eh?

KimmyQueen
Member

Poppa answered in less than an hour without anyone’s help. A normal person would apologize after being summarily ridiculed but instead Trollivia will come back with an assine translation or a nonsensical non-sequitur…

Olivia
Member
Olivia

********************
Poppajoe, can you list five school districts anywhere in the U.S. that regularly host concerts dedicated to Muslim religious holidays at taxpayer expense? How about three? One?

Didn’t think so.

Can anyone help him out here?

*********************
Well, so far, the only response I’ve seen is Poppajoe’s same list of opinion pieces arguing that we may be doing too much to accommodate Muslims. Nothing whatsoever about specific school districts holding school concerts honoring Muslim religious holidays at the expense of taxpayers.

Barb, you’re the one who made that claim. How come you haven’t yet coughed up any evidence to support it?

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

I beleive I went over and above by showing public schools teaching Islam on the taxpayer dime while denying anything to do with any Judeao-Christian practices.
As far as Barb not coughing up any evidence of your narrow requirement, regularly hosting concerts dedicated to Muslim religious holidays at taxpayer expense, probably because Muslims don’t hold holiday concerts anywhere!
How about your refusing to reply to my challenge to you!
https://www.ihatethemedia.com/do-not-stand-between-michelle-obama-and-the-fat-cakes/comment-page-1?replytocom=97535#respond
It’s only been 4 days since I challenged you, but you seem to be willing to only attack others and not respond when you have been proven a bigot!

Olivia
Member
Olivia

As far as Barb not coughing up any evidence of your narrow requirement, regularly hosting concerts dedicated to Muslim religious holidays at taxpayer expense, probably because Muslims don’t hold holiday concerts anywhere!
*********************
Better tell Barb, then. She seems to be under the impression that taxpayers are footing the bill for Muslim holiday concerts in public schools. 😉
***********************
How about your refusing to reply to my challenge to you!
https://www.ihatethemedia.com/do-not-stand-between-michelle-obama-and-the-fat-cakes/comment-page-1?replytocom=97535#respond
It’s only been 4 days since I challenged you, but you seem to be willing to only attack others and not respond when you have been proven a bigot!
**************************
Sorry, Poppajoe, but I have 20-odd posters flinging taunts and challenges at me. I don’t always have time to read and respond to all of them.

If you want me to respond to that one, I’m afraid you’re going to have to refresh my memory. I tried pasting the link into my browser, but it took me only to the page, not the specific post.

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

Sorry, Poppajoe, but I have 20-odd posters flinging taunts and challenges at me. I don’t always have time to read and respond to all of them.

REALLY? You took the time to give it a thumbs down, but not to read or reply to it? How curious.

https://www.ihatethemedia.com/do-not-stand-between-michelle-obama-and-the-fat-cakes/comment-page-1?replytocom=97535#comment-97535

brm
Member
brm

“Better tell Barb, then. She seems to be under the impression that taxpayers are footing the bill for Muslim holiday concerts in public schools ”

I do? I don’t recall ever saying that, but since the troll said it, it must be true.

Translation: Spin spin spin

brm
Member
brm

“Barb, you’re the one who made that claim. How come you haven’t yet coughed up any evidence to support it?”

I did. You must have (cough cough) accidentally MISSED them.

winkie winkie

drb
Member
drb

3

DefHarryMelon
Member
DefHarryMelon

Get to work! There are many fresh piles of visible oblovium around this place!

brm
Member
brm

“Get to work! There are many fresh piles of visible oblovium around this place!”

True enough, but I really REALLY need to get to work. Time to put my pointed mallet away.

drb
Member
drb

I’m going as fast as I can but my other 3 jobs keep getting in the way.

KimmyQueen
Member

Is okay RHG is up and around and I will do some as well…

RockingHorseGuy
Member

I retired from my equipment operating career Friday, to work twice as hard at my rocking horses and photography. But I think I’ll be able to help out with whacking trolls a bit more now.

brm
Member
brm

Congratulations on your hard-earned retirement, RHG. ENJOY!!!

RockingHorseGuy
Member

Thank you Barb! I do intend to enjoy my retirement, while working hard at the two income sources I have to supplement my meager union retirement. (I wasn’t a member of a public employee’s union.)

Like yesterday. Walking all over a car show, in the hot sun, lugging a bag of photographic equipment, and taking pictures of hundreds of extraordinarily beautiful scantily clad women. Now, THAT’S what I call hard work! I even took some pictures of the cars.

drb
Member
drb

Such hard work for a retired guy!

KimmyQueen
Member

Congrats on your retirement!

RockingHorseGuy
Member

Thanks Kimmy. And drb, it IS hard work, but somebody’s gotta do it. Then I spend a day editing and posting nearly a thousand pictures. I’m exhausted.

whiskeyriver
Member
whiskeyriver

Welcome to Ye Olde Farts Club RHG! I joined 6 years ago and have been having more fun than a man should be allowed.

I still work 50, 60 or more hours a week but at least I’m doing what I like to do instead of what I have to do. I work part time at the local convenience store to keep up with the local gossip, and earn a little beer and fishing money, but my main thing now is building custom wood furniture and refinishing old furniture.

The lady I work with is a master at refinishing antique wood furniture and we are now expanding into the building part. It is a learning process for both of us but things are moving along because both of us are committed to quality instead of quantity. She is putting a picture sample of her, now our, work together and if Mr. Editor and Administrator allow it I will do a shameless plug for the website here when things are ready.

Rock on buddy! Retirement is fun if you want it to be!

brm
Member
brm

Looking forward to seeing the site when it’s up, shameless plug aside. lol

RockingHorseGuy
Member

Oh, and I also can get to work on my next giant wooden rocking horse. Never did any woodworking before about 2002, and now I’m the world’s leading expert on building giant rocking horses out of plywood. Who woulda thunk it?

And, like Whiskey, working my butt off, and having the time of my life.

drb
Member
drb

Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness at it’s finest.

KimmyQueen
Member

I need to catch up.

brm
Member
brm

Maybe I can help. How about a public school district in the U.S. banning pork from their lunch menus to accommodate Muslim dietary guidelines.

That was in the early 1990s. Too distant for the troll? How about a U.S. public school district going Halal in 2001?

Or how about the 6th grade public school class in California who took a “field trip” to a local mosque? But since they were taken off school grounds, I guess that doesn’t technically qualify. But (dilemma here) the teachers were paid from public funds. I guess we’ll just have to leave that decision up to the Trier of Fact.

In any event, I’m sure the entire 6th grade class is looking forward to their sure-to-be upcoming field trip to the Catholic church which will be followed by the field trip to the synagogue! Such fun!

Now, for public school teachers who want to be progressive and inclusive, there are numerous teaching materials to help you convert … er, TEACH the younguns all about the Religion of Peace (TM).

A particularly fine teachers’ resource is entitled “Teaching About Islam in the Public School Classroom. ” And the www is very helpful in helping you find “Organizations Specializing in Islam for Public School Students”.

And that’s just the little wee kids. How about publicly funded universities like, oh let’s see, the University of Michigan – Dearborn? Does the troll really want to go there? Separation of mosque and state? Yeah, right.

Now let the troll commence lecturing us about fear mongering….three, two, one …

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Maybe I can help. How about a public school district in the U.S. banning pork from their lunch menus to accommodate Muslim dietary guidelines.

That was in the early 1990s. Too distant for the troll? How about a U.S. public school district going Halal in 2001?
******************************
Tell me how that’s different from public school cafeterias serving meatless dishes on Fridays to accommodate Catholic students. They’ve been doing that for decades, Barb. Didn’t you ever notice? Of course not, because you probably just took it for granted that Friday is fish day, just as Wednesday is (supposedly) Prince spaghetti day.
*************************************
Or how about the 6th grade public school class in California who took a “field trip” to a local mosque? But since they were taken off school grounds, I guess that doesn’t technically qualify. But (dilemma here) the teachers were paid from public funds. I guess we’ll just have to leave that decision up to the Trier of Fact.
**************************************
I can see where that would pose a problem, just as it would pose a problem to many parents and taxpayers if students were taken on a field trip to, say, Washington National Cathedral. Sure, there are many reasons to visit a cathedral or mosque that have nothing to do with religious indoctrination, but (as at least one poster here would say) it’s still not “PC” to do so.

Bottom line: I agree that that was poor judgment. I do NOT agree, though, that taking students to a mosque serves as evidence that the Muslim religion is being given preferential treatment in public schools. More likely, the teachers were hoping to break through some of the ignorance and bigotry that’s currently so much in vogue among our more xenophobic fellow citizens.

*************************************

In any event, I’m sure the entire 6th grade class is looking forward to their sure-to-be upcoming field trip to the Catholic church which will be followed by the field trip to the synagogue! Such fun!
*************************************
And, again, there are many reasons to visit churches or synagogues, other than religious indoctrination. But we don’t want to frighten the far right, so it’s probably best for public schools not to visit any house of worship for any reason.
********************************
Now, for public school teachers who want to be progressive and inclusive, there are numerous teaching materials to help you convert … er, TEACH the younguns all about the Religion of Peace (TM).

A particularly fine teachers’ resource is entitled “Teaching About Islam in the Public School Classroom. ” And the www is very helpful in helping you find “Organizations Specializing in Islam for Public School Students”.
************************************
Since so many Americans are appallingly ignorant about the Muslim religion and its followers, it only makes sense that someone would write a book clearing up some of the misconceptions, Barb. There are many books out there that teach about other religions and cultures. In what way do you consider it bad for teachers to learn something about these other religions and cultures? Did you seriously take that as evidence that they’re all going to go back and start trying to convert their pupils to Islam? 😀
**********************************
And that’s just the little wee kids. How about publicly funded universities like, oh let’s see, the University of Michigan – Dearborn? Does the troll really want to go there? Separation of mosque and state? Yeah, right.
***********************************
What’s the big problem that you see with Dearborn, Barb? The fact that they have (gasp!) foot washing basins for Muslim students? Or the fact that students are allowed to pray quietly in unoccupied rooms or on a corner of the grounds someplace?

The university I went to, many years ago, was unusually accommodating for students with disabilities—-it had paths designed for wheel chairs, signs in Braille all over the place, and special classes for the learning disabled. Even my dormitory cafeteria provided a chairless table for students with wheel chairs, so they wouldn’t have to move furniture before sitting down to dinner. Would you consider this a sign that the university was showing partiality toward these students? Or that they were subtly suggesting that the rest of us become disabled?

Of course not. Schools and universities do what they need to do to accommodate the needs of the particular population they serve. As long as that doesn’t place hardships or inconveniences on those who don’t have those needs, why would it be a problem for you?
***************************
Now let the troll commence lecturing us about fear mongering….three, two, one …
*************************
You know, it’s funny how you far righters keep referring to me with childish insults (“the troll,” “Oblivia,” “Nurse Ratched,” etc.) I suspect you’re trying to intimidate me through such schoolyard bully tactics, but in fact it has the opposite effect. I know that, if you were truly confident in your political views, you wouldn’t have to resort to that sort of silliness.

As for your claim about “fear mongering”: tell me what you’re afraid will happen, if a college with a large Muslim population provides foot basins in the rest rooms for the use of students, faculty and employees. If you’re that frightened of unfamiliar bathroom fixtures, you’d better stay out of old European cafes and public rest rooms on the autoroutes. No doubt those scary looking Turkish toilets (Turkish equals—gasp!—-Muslim, get it?) would send you over the edge. 😉

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

Trollivia:
“Tell me how that’s different from public school cafeterias serving meatless dishes on Fridays to accommodate Catholic students.”

It’s completely different! Offering meatless dishes to accomodate a large population of students comes nowhere close to banning pork from their lunch menus to accommodate Muslim dietary guidelines.

Or is it too nuanced for you to grasp the difference between “offering” and “banning”?

No public school has ever banned anything that doesn’t confirm to Jewish dietary guidelines, and I should know, the town I grew up in had a very large Jewish population. In fact, it is home to one of the most revered Hacidic universities in the country!

I can’t believe I had actually tried considering you as intelligent at first! That is a ship that has sailed!

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Tell me how that’s different from public school cafeterias serving meatless dishes on Fridays to accommodate Catholic students.”

It’s completely different! Offering meatless dishes to accomodate a large population of students comes nowhere close to banning pork from their lunch menus to accommodate Muslim dietary guidelines.
********************
Why is it “completely different,” Poppajoe? If a school district has a large percentage of Muslim students, why would it be inappropriate for the cafeteria to take their dietary traditions into consideration?
********************
Or is it too nuanced for you to grasp the difference between “offering” and “banning”?

Not at all, Poppajoe. But, from what I’ve seen, Muslims aren’t necessarily asking schools to “ban” all foods that their children can’t eat—-just to make sure that there are healthy alternatives for them. If the school system decides that it’s easier and cheaper just to “ban” all pork products than to offer alternatives, then that’s their choice.
********************
No public school has ever banned anything that doesn’t confirm to Jewish dietary guidelines, and I should know, the town I grew up in had a very large Jewish population.
*********************
Jews, like Christians, vary enormously in how closely they adhere to traditional teachings, Poppajoe. Some keep strict kosher; others don’t keep it at all.
*********************
In fact, it is home to one of the most revered Hacidic universities in the country!
******************
That’s “Hasidic,” Poppajoe. (I’m kind of wondering, though, why anyone, Hasidic or otherwise, would want to “revere” a university.) Does the town you grew up in have Jewish private schools? Because Jewish families who keep kosher would have a hard time with ANY public school cafeteria, it seems to me, that doesn’t conform to their rather strict dietary and food preparation guidelines.

Of course, if Muslim parents got together and created more private Muslim schools, in order to ensure that their kids could dress and eat according to religious traditions, I suspect you be yelling and screaming about terrorist training grounds.

************************
I can’t believe I had actually tried considering you as intelligent at first! That is a ship that has sailed!
*************************
I’m sorry, Poppajoe, but anyone who tries to use a rant from WND or American Thinker as “evidence” of anything ought not to be labeling anyone else unintelligent.

But keep up those childish insults. They serve as a great reminder to me that you’re incapable of debating the issue on its own merits, and must resort to childish efforts at intimidation instead.

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

Maybe I can help. How about a public school district in the U.S. banning pork from their lunch menus to accommodate Muslim dietary guidelines.

drb
Member
drb

Or it could be due the the push for a veggie plate from vegetarians and nothing to do with catholics at all.

brm
Member
brm

“Of course not, because you probably just took it for granted that Friday is fish day,”

I didn’t go to a school with a cafeteria, so I wasn’t aware they were doing that.

Apparently our troll has a problem with the United States of America being founded on Judeo-Christian values. I wonder why that would be?

Oh yeah! Thank a liberal!

Olivia
Member
Olivia

“Of course not, because you probably just took it for granted that Friday is fish day,”

I didn’t go to a school with a cafeteria, so I wasn’t aware they were doing that.

Apparently our troll has a problem with the United States of America being founded on Judeo-Christian values. I wonder why that would be?

************************
Please show me where in the Constitution it states that this nation must adhere to “Judeo-Christian values,” Barb. Or that all residents who are neither Jewish nor Christian must conform to Jewish and/or Christian cultural standards.

(In fact, I can’t remember a single Jew being directly involved with drafting the Constitution, or insisting that his religion form part of the “values” of the new nation. Isn’t that odd?)

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

In fact, I can’t remember a single Jew being directly involved with drafting the Constitution.

Nor were there Muslims, however this country seems to be bending over backwards to accomodate them in direct violation of the no religion in public schools edict that the ACLU fought so hard for!

The point that seems to be so convieniently evading your narrow mind is that you can’t get away with saying no religion in school for Christians and Jews, but it’s OK for Muslims. That is what is happening, it is a fact, you are an idiot!

Olivia
Member
Olivia

In fact, I can’t remember a single Jew being directly involved with drafting the Constitution.

Nor were there Muslims, however this country seems to be bending over backwards to accomodate them in direct violation of the no religion in public schools edict that the ACLU fought so hard for!

The point that seems to be so convieniently evading your narrow mind is that you can’t get away with saying no religion in school for Christians and Jews, but it’s OK for Muslims. That is what is happening, it is a fact, you are an idiot!

**************************
Wrong, Poppajoe. You’ve provided absolutely no evidence that Muslim religious doctrine is being taught in public schools. Zero.

If you want to keep arguing that issue, best start digging for that evidence. And I’m NOT talking about hysterical World Nut Daily rants.

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

“Wrong, Poppajoe. You’ve provided absolutely no evidence that Muslim religious doctrine is being taught in public schools. Zero.”

http://www.historytextbooks.org/islam.htm
http://socialismisnottheanswer.wordpress.com/2010/05/16/islam-in-public-schools/
From the second link.
The lawsuit stems from a state mandated course in California public schools that requires seventh grade students to learn about Islam, the teachings of Muhammad, as well as studying scriptures from the Quran.

Game, Set, Match!

Olivia
Member
Olivia

“Wrong, Poppajoe. You’ve provided absolutely no evidence that Muslim religious doctrine is being taught in public schools. Zero.”

http://www.historytextbooks.org/islam.htm
http://socialismisnottheanswer.wordpress.com/2010/05/16/islam-in-public-schools/
From the second link.
The lawsuit stems from a state mandated course in California public schools that requires seventh grade students to learn about Islam, the teachings of Muhammad, as well as studying scriptures from the Quran.

Game, Set, Match!
*****************************
Out of bounds, Poppajoe. Better think about getting a new racket. 😉
Since what you provided here was merely a (what else?) right wing opinion piece, I did a quick google search to look up the case in question.

Guess what, Poppajoe? Aside from this very same opinion piece posted on several right wing Christian and political websites, there is absolutely nothing about this case on the internet. So, in essence, you’re taking the word of “Thomas More Law Center” (“public interests,” my hind end—-that’s a right wing political and religious organization!) without bothering to hear the other side of the story.

So I went to Snopes, which regularly debunks about half of the fairy tales the far right regularly falls for. And, just as I suspected, there’s more to the story than your slickly anti-Obama website saw fit to mention. (Oh, yes, I saw the cutesy little photoshopped pictures of “Barry.” The Koch brothers are leaving no stone unturned to appeal to your emotions, are they?) 😉

snopes.com: Islam Studies in California Schools

Snopes doesn’t allow C&Ping of their comments, but, basically, what you thought was an example of “Muslim religious doctrine” being taught was merely a unit from the textbook, Across The Centuries. In essence, it depicts world history, not just from a western military point of view, but from a cultural and philosophical point of view as well.

Examples of two units in the textbook:
Chapter 3, Lesson 2: Muhammad and Islam (pp. 58-64)

The Big Idea
Framework Concepts: Culture and Values In the 600s, the prophet Muhammad founded a major religion, Islam, which spread across Arabia and became a way of life still practiced widely today.

Ask students to share what they already know about Islam. Without commenting, write their ideas on the board. Then discuss how religion is an important part of many people’s lives. You might want to mention any mosques or Muslim practices evident in your community. After reading the section, ask students to review the comments written on the board about Islam. Circle the comments that were correct, and erase those that were not.
Lesson Outline
Use the Lesson Outline to preview the content of the lesson. You may wish to print it for your students as a guide during reading.

Check for Understanding

Have students work in pairs to create a chart reviewing key teachings and beliefs of Islam. Encourage students to include explanations about how these beliefs affect the everyday life of Muslims.
Have students create a story map chronicling events in the life of Muhammad, including his trip to Mount Hira, his teaching in Mecca and emigration to Medina, and his eventual return to Mecca.
Lesson at a Glance
Chapter 13, Lesson 2: Martin Luther and the Reformation (pp. 342-347)

The Big Idea
Framework Concepts: Values and Change The ideas of reformer Martin Luther, who sought to reform the Catholic church by protesting corruption and abuses, spread throughout Europe.

Write the words “Protestant” and “Reformation” on the board. Point out that the roots of these words are “protest” and “reform.” What does it mean to “protest” against something? Are there circumstances affecting students’ lives that they would like to protest? How might they go about such a protest? Students may be familiar with such phrases as “welfare reform” and “tax reform.” What is “reform”? What aspects of school or community life do students think need reform? How might students go about achieving such reform?
Lesson Outline
Use the Lesson Outline to preview the content of the lesson. You may wish to print it for your students as a guide during reading.

Check for Understanding

Ask students to choose an event mentioned in the lesson, such as Luther’s posting of Ninety-Five Theses or his defiance of the Emperor in Worms. Have them write a newspaper editorial in which they take a stand either supporting or condemning Luther’s actions. Then have students compare their editorials by reading them aloud.
Have students create a poster illustrating the key events of Martin Luther’s life.

As Huckleberry Finn would put it, anyone but a lot of prejudiced chuckleheads could see that the first lesson in no way pushes Islamic doctrine, any more than the second one encourages the students to become Lutherans.

The problem (and court case) apparently stemmed from one teacher’s decision to have the kids role play living under the various religions. Probably not a wise or “politically correct” idea, but the court found no evidence that s/he was pushing Islamic doctrine, or requiring the students to “study scripture from the Quran.”

Sorry, Poppajoe, but that’s one of the prices you pay for getting all your “information” from right wing opinion pieces on the internet, instead of trying to find out all sides to the story. Let me give you a piece of advice: if a synopsis of an issue provides only one side, and either ignores, glosses over or paraphrases the other side, it’s not a trustworthy reference.

And, if it features a lot of silly photoshopped “Baby Barry” pictures, it’s not a serious one, either. 😀

drb
Member
drb

“out of bounds”

I thought you didn’t try to make up the rules as you went along.

whiskeyriver
Member
whiskeyriver

Ollie, your true colors are becoming clear. You are trying to justify a stance on the seperation of church and state by claiming that teaching one particular religion is OK but not any other religious belief. Does the word “hypocrite” mean anything to you?

When I attended pubic schrewel the religious beliefs of our founding fathers was not mentioned. We learned America was founded on the principles of religious and economic freedom but no particular religion was ever mentioned other as an aside.

William Penn and Ben Franklin were Quakers. George Washington and Thomas Jefferson were Protestants, or something, and we kids could have cared less. What we did learn is these great men, with a vision for the future of a young country, put the words on paper and helped establish the greatest, most powerful and generous country civilization has ever known. And the teaching was all done without any religious leanings at all.

Public school teachers should be teaching reading, writing, math, science, geography and American history. Period, the end.

If the kid wants to delve into different religions in different parts of the world he/she can do so on their own time. Catholic, Jew, Baptist, Muslim, Methodist, Mormon, Seventh Day Advantist, Quaker, Jehova’s Witness, Shinto, Moonies, any and all of of the silly sects we call “religion” have no place in the classroom.

If you cannot handle this simple concept of what should be taught in a public, taxpayer funded school, then slap your old burqa on your head, pull the veil down over your eyes so you cannot see reality, then haul your ass back to wherever you came from. No religious sect has ever run this country and none ever will.

drb
Member
drb

3, the fun never ends.

KimmyQueen
Member

You killing it today DRB.

drb
Member
drb

Just hitting it at the right time.

KimmyQueen
Member

I am not okay with the banning to make allocations for one group of people. That is not freedom. However, offering alternatives to allocate everyone is acceptable. I don’t like this thing about having to take everyone out that is not part of a group to use a piece of land that is meant to be used by everyone.

I do not recall any actual jewish person that signed the constitution. Alexander Hamilton had jewish ties (he went to a jewish school I understand) however do not know if he considered himself Jewish. However there are quite a few founding fathers, so to speak, who were jewish. I do not remember their names, but I know that Glenn Beck mentioned a few.

In addition to that, the Jewish Torah and Judaic Laws framed the mentalities of a lot of framers and founders. A lot of education was framed around Judeo-Christian principles. Benjamin Franklin and Thomas Jefferson proposed a design for the National Seal, representing Moses crossing the Red Sea, with Pharaoh in hot pursuit. It included the motto: ‘Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God’. On the top of the Washington Memorial on the east side there is an inscription: Laus Deo. “In G-d we trust” in the money… I don’t think people understand that the roots are real and they are important.

brm
Member
brm

“What’s the big problem that you see with Dearborn, Barb? The fact that they have (gasp!) foot washing basins for Muslim students? Or the fact that students are allowed to pray quietly in unoccupied rooms or on a corner of the grounds someplace?”

I don’t know what’s wrong with it. I wasn’t the one who said that religious activities should not be allowed on the taxpayers’ dime or in taxpayer funded buildings.

But I had no doubt at all that the liberals would think there was absolutely nothing wrong with providing a prayer room AKA mosque in a taxpayer funded building/facility. And you were just pleased as punch to confirm it.

Olivia
Member
Olivia

“What’s the big problem that you see with Dearborn, Barb? The fact that they have (gasp!) foot washing basins for Muslim students? Or the fact that students are allowed to pray quietly in unoccupied rooms or on a corner of the grounds someplace?”

I don’t know what’s wrong with it. I wasn’t the one who said that religious activities should not be allowed on the taxpayers’ dime or in taxpayer funded buildings.

But I had no doubt at all that the liberals would think there was absolutely nothing wrong with providing a prayer room AKA mosque
********************
A prayer room isn’t a “mosque,” any more than the private “meditation room” in my hospital is a church, Barb.

Why would you be opposed to Muslim students using an unoccupied room, or a corner of the campus, for private prayers if they choose? Would you be equally put out if a Baptist student ducked into an empty room and said a private prayer?
*****************************
in a taxpayer funded building/facility. And you were just pleased as punch to confirm it.
*****************************
Come on, Barb—you can do better than that. (Although, after that pompous claim that “our nation is founded on Judeo-Christian values,” maybe you can’t…..) There’s a big difference between letting students use a vacant room or corner for private devotions, and building them a mosque.

And I’m still waiting for your evidence that public schools are allowing Muslims to hold prayer services that ban non-Muslims and menstruating women from the premises.

brm
Member
brm

You’re still waiting? You split the thread some time ago, so apparently you missed my responses.

Here’s another one for you, with all the work done. I apologize to the rest of the IHTM readers for the length, but our troll needs special instruction since she doesn’t appear to know how to use Google. I have provided URLs and some excerpts for your entertainment.

This article is from the Globe and Mail. Maybe our troll will consider this a neutral source because it is pretty much a left-wing rag.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/toronto/interest-groups-criticize-toronto-school-board-decision-on-islamic-prayers/article2089829/

“A diverse collection of interest groups is speaking out against the Toronto District School Board’s decision to accommodate Muslim students’ right to freedom of religion by allowing an imam to lead Friday prayers in a North York middle school cafeteria.”

From the Toronto Sun:
http://www.torontosun.com/2011/07/07/public-school-prayer-sessions-criticized

(I particularly like the “white, liberal guilt” part.)
“Islamic prayer sessions at public schools send participating girls the message they’re second-class citizens, says a prominent voice from the Muslim community.

The controversial sessions — traditionally set up with boys in the front and girls behind them — are patriarchal and should not be conducted in publicly-funded schools, insisted Tarek Fatah, founder of the Muslim Canadian Congress.

“My concern is the Toronto District School Board (is) using tax money to tell girls that they are second-class citizens,” Fatah said Thursday.

He charged that proponents of the prayer sessions are allowing them to happen because of “white, liberal guilt.”

“Deep inside is a racist view that Muslims are not considered equal human beings, and that they can treat women how they want, and it’s nobody else’s concern,” said Fatah.”

More from The Toronto Sun:

http://management.torontosun.com/2011/07/05/muslim-group-wants-prayer-in-public-school-stopped

Homa Arjomand, of International Campaign Against Sharia Courts in Canada, called the service a “political statement” by Muslim leaders.

“We are against this 100% because it has nothing to do with the public school system,” Arjomand said. “The Muslims are trying to influence secular institutions in Canada.”

From the Humanist Association of Toronto (according to the website, they are “… an independent, non-profit, charitable organization. We promote Secular Humanism and the separation of church and state.” I’m sure that meets with the troll’s approval.

http://humanisttoronto.blogspot.com/2011/07/friday-prayer-service-at-school.html

“Board spokesperson Shari Schwartz-Maltz said the sheer number of students leaving the school — some 300 to 400 out of 1,200 — was a factor in the decision, as well as the amount of class time they lost making the trip. Safety was also a concern…
Critics have raised questions not just about religious services in a public school, but also about how boys and girls are separated at Valley Park during the service — with girls in the back, behind a divider — or that girls who are menstruating sit on the sidelines and not take part.

“Education Minister Leona Dombrowsky was not available for comment, but just last year the ministry implemented an inclusive policy, based on the Ontario Human Rights Code. Jim Spyropoulos, the board’s superintendent of inclusive schools, said each school will come up with its own solution to best fit student needs.

“As for religious practices that raise questions of gender equity, he said ‘because prayer is not conducted under the auspices of the board, we don’t have the right to tell people how to pray.'”

Did you catch that last part? Religious services being held in public schools during school hours, with girls being placed at the back of the room because they are less than males, but the Board of Ed doesn’t have the right to tell people how to pray.

THANK WHITE LIBERAL GUILT!

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Did you catch that last part? Religious services being held in public schools during school hours, with girls being placed at the back of the room because they are less than males, but the Board of Ed doesn’t have the right to tell people how to pray.

THANK WHITE LIBERAL GUILT!

**********************
And again I’ll remind you, Barb: Toronto is not part of the United States, so what has any of this to do with my question to you?

Olivia
Member
Olivia

They won’t even let us have Christmas concerts anymore – they are “holiday” concerts. And it’s not the Muslim community who spearheaded that – it was the liberals.

*******************
Wrong. No one is telling you you can’t host, attend and participate in all the Christmas concerts you please. What we’re saying is that you can’t expect to do it on the taxpayers’ dime, or on property paid for by taxpayers.

brm
Member
brm

Did it just say that Christmas concerts are not allowed on the taxpayers’ dime or on property paid by the taxpayers, but that it is acceptable for Muslims to hold prayer services in a public school cafeteria during school hours while barring all non-Muslims and menstruating females.

Really. Really?

xcop
Member
xcop

BOON is racist.The full phrase is she-boon.M.O.is the first she-boon.It is a racist term to refer to a black woman.

KimmyQueen
Member

Thank you. Sometimes it is unfortunate to learn something (like this) new everyday.

Alien
Member
Alien

Don’t give up on the word. It is as old as Time.. It has roots in the Vikings and the Romans, and I would bet money Indo-European roots. It used to mean prayer. Boon or Bane. I’ve never seen it used in a racist way and hope not to again.

Yeah, i should’ve checked the UD.. I did get reminded its the opposite of noob, too (and that got more votes)

I tire of these racists too.. they are a waste of flesh and time and energy

KimmyQueen
Member

Agreed.

DefHarryMelon
Member
DefHarryMelon

Ridiculous. There are people who turn anything into racism. See this – http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,380143,00.html. Astronomers have apparently been racists for a long time. I suppose we’d better rename the crayon Black to something less racist. Perhaps the color of this type should be referred to something less racist, maybe Extra Deep Gray? I am personally offended each time I see White flour in bags on the shelves in the grocery store, especially if it says bleached and bromated! Brown sugar really pist me off once, too.

KimmyQueen
Member

That is true language sometimes can be mistreated to make something out that is not. She-boon to me means absolutely nothing… but I guess it may mean something to someone who has nothing better to do than make up words.

Olivia
Member
Olivia

That is true language sometimes can be mistreated to make something out that is not.
***********************
True. Frank Luntz has achieved fame and fortune doing exactly that for the GOP.

KimmyQueen
Member

THIRD!!! First one of the day…

RockingHorseGuy
Member

Thunderous applause!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

KimmyQueen
Member

Thank you, Thank you! There are a few out there for you to divert yourself with.

drb
Member
drb

Yay, take over…I think I bagged my limit today.

KimmyQueen
Member

You make whack a trollers proud!

drb
Member
drb

I do my best 😉

RockingHorseGuy
Member

I think the three of us should take a bow!

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

You are my heros.

RockingHorseGuy
Member

All in a day’s work, Poppa.

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

Has anyone else noticed that the troll claims to not watch TV, but knows that All in the Family is currently playing on TV Land, and also knows who Frank Luntz is?

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Has anyone else noticed that the troll claims to not watch TV, but knows that All in the Family is currently playing on TV Land, and also knows who Frank Luntz is?

********************
Uh….Poppajoe? YOU told me, yourself, that you were watching All In The Family on TV recently. Do you think it was such a stretch for me to conclude that that means that All In The Family reruns are currently being shown on TV?

As for Frank Luntz: He’s famous. He’s written several books on the spin doctoring of language—-pardon me, I mean choosing the best words and phrases to get one’s point across—-and has worked closely with the GOP for this very purpose. He lectures around the country, and has been interviewed many times. What’s more, the Democrats watch him rather closely, since his spin is a powerful GOP weapon.

Apparently you know him only as a TV personality. That says more about you than it does about him OR me.

But it intrigues me that you seem anxious to prove that I was lying about not having TV reception. Why would it matter to you? It certainly doesn’t matter to me if you lounge around watching All In The Family reruns. 😉

poppajoe49
Guest
poppajoe49

Oblivious:
“YOU told me, yourself, that you were watching All In The Family on TV recently. Do you think it was such a stretch for me to conclude that that means that All In The Family reruns are currently being shown on TV?”

But you said TVLand, which is only available on cable or satellite, so which is it? You say you have no TV reception, do you have cable or satellite, or are you just lying?

Olivia
Member
Olivia

Oblivious:
“YOU told me, yourself, that you were watching All In The Family on TV recently. Do you think it was such a stretch for me to conclude that that means that All In The Family reruns are currently being shown on TV?”

But you said TVLand, which is only available on cable or satellite, so which is it? You say you have no TV reception, do you have cable or satellite, or are you just lying?
*****************************
When did I say anything about All In The Family being on TV Land?

I’m sorry to burst your bubble, PoppaJoe, but I have neither cable nor satellite TV. Why are you so determined to believe I’d lie about something so silly? 😀

jwilson07
Member
jwilson07

Being a liberal means you tell the truth by accident if at all. Like any socialist or communist you consider the truth” what you decide is the truth” just like your hero Joe Stalin.

drb
Member
drb

3rds once more

DefHarryMelon
Member
DefHarryMelon

Applied in a sense of racism, virtually any word can be a slur. What the hell is ‘she-boon.M.O’ supposed to mean, anyway? Uppercase letters and extraneous punctuation all over the place is like rap musician naming procedures. Does it mean She minus b00n decimal m00n period Oh! or what?

The word ‘Teh’ is likely racist, too.

DefHarryMelon
Member
DefHarryMelon

Nonsense. Rap star name is what it looks like with uppercase letters and extraneous punctuation. Is black hole racist? How about white flour or brown sugar? The red-eye flight?

I posted something much like this about an hour ago and it seems to have been removed! Hey! Look! They’re back now!

Olivia
Member
Olivia

A boon to our little IHTM site has been the advent of the new game ‘Whack A Troll’, for the relief it affords those of us who prefer not to be spoken down to by our moral and intellectual superiors, the boastful correctionists and learned progressives, as well as those translators who apparently missed their calling in life.
*****************
Translation: “Despite the efforts of right wing media to inflate my self-esteem, I still feel at a disadvantage whenever anyone challenges me on a discussion board. I’ve solved this problem by banding together with other insecure righties, and “hiding” any posts that don’t agree with the talking points I parrot here. Not only is it foolproof (which makes it attractive to us fools), but it protects me from ever being exposed to a viewpoint other than the Koch-approved ones fed to me by my favorite media heroes.”

That’s okay, ex-Dean. You go ahead and whack, if it gives you pleasure. It doesn’t hurt me, so if it props up your self-esteem a bit, who am I to object? 😉

KimmyQueen
Member

THIRD!!!!

I knew your post would get Translated DeanH it was done rather sooner than I expected too.

drb
Member
drb

Excellent baiting of the trap there DeanH.

DefHarryMelon
Member
DefHarryMelon

Aw, shucks. nyuk-nyuk.